tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post9219352908543024530..comments2024-03-28T03:16:14.104-04:00Comments on Noahpinion: Solar is libertarian, nuclear is statistNoah Smithhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09093917601641588575noreply@blogger.comBlogger39125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-66886396445776996352013-09-25T21:54:55.073-04:002013-09-25T21:54:55.073-04:00Where are you getting the thing about nimby concer...Where are you getting the thing about nimby concerns stopping Japan building newer, safer plants? Pre-Fukushima Japan had a lot of success getting rural communities to accept nuclear power (per-gigawatt it doesn't cost much to buy off a declining coastal village), and was building a lot of new nuclear.<br /><br />The reason for keeping old power stations going rather than building new ones is simply that they cost a lot to build and a lot to decommission, but provide very cheap power in between, so keeping a nuclear power station running a little bit longer is a very attractive proposition.Edmund in Tokyohttp://www.twitter.com/edmundedgarnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-67724328865859205372013-08-16T13:22:46.125-04:002013-08-16T13:22:46.125-04:00Well, you see noah, everybody doesn´t live in the ...Well, you see noah, everybody doesn´t live in the Arizona desert or near the coast line (if you prefer that other stupid gov subsidized hobby energy power system). What is it in your understandig of Nuclear power that says it must be governed by a central cleptocratic gov.? The anarchist society is more than well equipped to maintain nuclear power plants, don´t ya' think? <br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-72893520243888030332013-08-16T13:11:07.969-04:002013-08-16T13:11:07.969-04:00I´m a libertarian and I fucking hate this gov subs...I´m a libertarian and I fucking hate this gov subsidized solar energy shit. Nuclear power is the only way the developing world is going to get to the same standards as we in the west. Nuclear power is powering democracy. On this topic most/many libertarians is totally delusional. I´m ashamed.Dividendumhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01567683892874000431noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-57359971731175719652013-08-15T16:58:15.852-04:002013-08-15T16:58:15.852-04:00Go to www.libertarianinternational.org
The guy w...Go to www.libertarianinternational.org <br /><br />The guy who invented modern Libertarianism heads it, and the group controls Libertarian usage.<br /><br />You'll always be confused if you don't check the source. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-88575042062216995172013-04-20T14:35:39.769-04:002013-04-20T14:35:39.769-04:00We at Noahpinion would like to thank you for takin...We at Noahpinion would like to thank you for taking the time to write this insightful comment. Please take a complementary keychain and frisbee.Noah Smithhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09093917601641588575noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-7909166995161790782013-04-20T11:49:08.233-04:002013-04-20T11:49:08.233-04:00"Libertarians have always seemed to have a so..."Libertarians have always seemed to have a soft spot for nuclear energy and an instinctive dislike of solar power"<br /><br />Stopped right here... Figured if it opened this bad, the rest wasn't getting better.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-32359176540378251702013-04-16T16:29:46.297-04:002013-04-16T16:29:46.297-04:00I'm used to self-administered labels being fuz...I'm used to self-administered labels being fuzzy identifiers, but this word "libertarian" completely flummoxes me. As far as I can tell, there seems to be a suite of attitudes and beliefs associated with the term, but since each "libertarian" has a unique and different collection picked from that suite, I have been unable to form any sort of coherent idea of exactly what a "libertarian" might be. I've provisionally settled on "selfish, muddled and immature", but I admit I've been largely influenced by the number of "libertarians" who claim to have been influenced by the writings of Ayn Rand. In any event, I suspect that trying to determine what a "libertarian" should or should not support is a pointless exercise. In any group of ten "libertarians", I suspect that there will be at least 15 different sets of beliefs about any phenomenon, depending on the time of day, proximity to the meal, weather and/or degree of personal physical fulfillment, among other things. Otherwise, interesting post, as usual, Noah!JohnRnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-17538274192618554462013-04-16T12:02:42.397-04:002013-04-16T12:02:42.397-04:00A good argument, but perhaps many libertarians agr...A good argument, but perhaps many libertarians agree with paraphrased Deng: not everything is libertarianism vs statism.Wonks Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-15713285848791599232013-04-15T20:10:06.443-04:002013-04-15T20:10:06.443-04:00Cars are statist
Bicycles are libertarian
Skateboa...Cars are statist<br />Bicycles are libertarian<br />Skateboards are anarchist!MaxUtilitynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-33907131806496609652013-04-15T13:42:15.676-04:002013-04-15T13:42:15.676-04:00"Government subsidies to solar companies"..."Government subsidies to solar companies" need to be viewed in context. As long as the government is subsidizing carbon fuels, we are merely talking about leveling the playing field, and probably something short of that. If we had a proper carbon tax, then solar subsidies would be both inefficient and unnecessary.Gnashhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17679372030523202284noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-25578783640647934562013-04-15T02:58:31.906-04:002013-04-15T02:58:31.906-04:00a)Chernobyl and Fukushima aren't really compar...a)Chernobyl and Fukushima aren't really comparable.<br />b)Fukushima plant was built long before Chernobyl and was supposed to be shut down but couldn't because the NIMBY crowd didn't want newer, safer nuclear plants to be built and they didn't have viable alternatives.<br />c)The biggest hurdle with nuclear in the US regulatory.gthttp://rationalskepticism.orgnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-33777969262056656092013-04-14T20:56:16.453-04:002013-04-14T20:56:16.453-04:00Solar works fine during non-peak hours, because yo...Solar works fine during non-peak hours, because you are not running your devices off your panels, you're running them off your stored power (generally batteries) which are charged by your panels. Or for solar hot water from your stored tank of hot water.<br /><br />Yes, you do better when the sun is shining because the power you're using is replenished more instantaneously, but the idea that solar doesn't provide you power to use when the sun isn't shining is wrong. <br /><br />The biggest problem solar has is utility companies being scared they won't have complete control of your power system.anthrosciguynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-49199544808303079862013-04-14T20:31:08.185-04:002013-04-14T20:31:08.185-04:00I don't get it - if you are good libertarian, ...I don't get it - if you are good libertarian, you'll be able to have any type of power generation you like as long as the government doesn't prevent you from doing business. Just ask the Coch bros. Dimitarhttp://lazyfairyecon.tumblr.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-23729185738503201212013-04-14T19:38:39.494-04:002013-04-14T19:38:39.494-04:00Most skateboarders I see are:
1) using public roa...Most skateboarders I see are:<br />1) using public roads;<br />2) using skate parks built with public or charitable money;<br />3) trespassing.<br /><br />A small minority use their father's driveway. <br /><br />So that seems about right for the Libertarian position - taking the infrastructure built by others as a God given endowment and natural right. Absalonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09131268683451462949noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-71306534966457675802013-04-14T17:35:46.564-04:002013-04-14T17:35:46.564-04:00Not bad!Not bad!Noah Smithhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09093917601641588575noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-69637446173343355122013-04-14T15:55:47.988-04:002013-04-14T15:55:47.988-04:00Next week: "Skateboards are libertarian, cars...Next week: "Skateboards are libertarian, cars are statist." Same arguments will work.Bob Murphyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04001108408649311528noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-17527898412089999992013-04-14T13:01:20.347-04:002013-04-14T13:01:20.347-04:00Nuclear is attractive to survivalist libertarians ...Nuclear is attractive to survivalist libertarians because of the "don't tread on me" plowshares to swords thing. Look at Iran and their "we only want to build peaceful nuclear power plants" stories when everyone knows that they really want bomb materials so that they can be as "respected" as North Korea. These are the same libertarians who only need their AR-15's for self-defense against those marauding bands of suburban bandits that will come rampaging out of decrepit city centers any day now.<br /><br />Photovoltaic solar cells require huge state-subsidized investments in high-tech fabs before they can be assembled into panels and installed by low-tech small entrepreneurs. Solar thermal systems, on the other hand can be completely developed using basic materials and electrical systems that would have been totally understandable by Thomas Edison and George Westinghouse.<br />G3Vnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-41744301907982346672013-04-14T12:17:42.390-04:002013-04-14T12:17:42.390-04:00Subtracting government subsides, Nuclear Power ha...Subtracting government subsides, Nuclear Power has NEVER turned a profit. Bill Ellisnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-28350325580288211152013-04-14T09:15:14.668-04:002013-04-14T09:15:14.668-04:00Erm, plentiful corn due to ludicrous govt subsidie...Erm, plentiful corn due to ludicrous govt subsidies?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-62832397165563180952013-04-14T08:23:01.703-04:002013-04-14T08:23:01.703-04:00Yep. For most libertarians, that is sufficient re...Yep. For most libertarians, that is sufficient reason to oppose solar power. Mutatis mutandis for nuclear.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-11237401455342276422013-04-13T20:13:57.778-04:002013-04-13T20:13:57.778-04:00Nice column, Noah. I'd add that the Fukushima ...Nice column, Noah. I'd add that the Fukushima disaster isn't so much "recent" as it is "ongoing." For instance,<br /><br />http://www.nytimes.com/2013/04/11/world/asia/fukushima-nuclear-plant-is-still-unstable-japanese-official-says.html?pagewanted=all&_r=2&<br /><br />And see "Reaping the Whirlwind of State Aggression: Nuclear Consequences" for a more direct look at how the State has, essentially, already destroyed the biosphere via nuclear power and other State-caused evils. http://strike-the-root.com/reaping-whirlwind-of-state-aggression-nuclear-consequences Glen Allporthttp://strike-the-root.com/user/8noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-68509036387990634962013-04-13T17:40:33.056-04:002013-04-13T17:40:33.056-04:00Once you come to the realization (as I did a few y...Once you come to the realization (as I did a few years back) that many self-described "libertarians" (especially those affiliated with institutes backed by the Kochs and their ilk) would be better described as "lackeys for rich people who call themselves libertarians", a ton of stuff start making sense.<br /><br />For instance, any true libertarian should be opposed to monopoly power, yet you hear a ton of Cato & Cato-lite acolytes extolling JD Rockefeller. Oh right. In the perfect libertarian world, monopolies wouldn't exist. And there wouldn't be collusion between government and businesses. All businessmen would refrain from buying government because they're all good-hearted hard-working Randists who want to compete fair and square.<br /><br /><br /><br />BTW, I support both solar and nuclear power.Dohsanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07884148005077602324noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-42214029725970596732013-04-13T15:40:36.091-04:002013-04-13T15:40:36.091-04:00Seems to me that solar is always going to crash up...Seems to me that solar is always going to crash up against the energy density problem (it takes a lot of space) and probably against the storage problem.<br /><br />Modular nuclear (probably fueled by thorium) seems likely to be the ultimate energy solution. Make them small enough (< 250 Megawatts) and reliable/safe enough and the private sector will build them.<br /><br />On paying for research - there is some research the benefits of which cannot be captured by a private developer or, if there are effective intellectual property rights, the transaction costs are so high that the research results cannot be effectively sold. Add in the fact that government has a lower discount rate than the private sector and the case for a large role for government in research becomes compelling. Absalonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09131268683451462949noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-86201359184097068442013-04-13T14:03:40.004-04:002013-04-13T14:03:40.004-04:00I went through all the thorium literature a few ye...I went through all the thorium literature a few years ago. Looked plausible. In fact, it looked plausibly _decentralized_. Due to the lack of proliferation risk and the reactor design, you can actually manufacture small reactors and place them throughout the grid on relatively small parcels of land.<br /><br />As a libertarian and former electrical energy system modeler, my only objection to solar (or any energy source) is production subsidies. If solar's levelized cost makes it the superior choice (which it does in a small but growing number of sunny + disperse areas of the US and many micro installations), go for it.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17232051.post-21447264151974443192013-04-13T13:42:07.823-04:002013-04-13T13:42:07.823-04:00What you're missing, Noah, is that hippies sup...What you're missing, Noah, is that hippies support solar power.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com